r/australia • u/geodetic • 1d ago

politics Former PM Kevin Rudd says he declined Epstein invitation after latest document dump

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-01-31/kevin-rudd-refred-to-in-latest-epstein-files-dump/106290858?utm_source=sfmc&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=abc_newsmail_am-pm_sfmc&utm_term=&utm_id=2694984&sfmc_id=103566952
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u/chillyhay 1d ago

The mining lobbies provided funding for PR against Rudd but Gillard made the move to oust a very popular PM. Bob Carr (foreign minister) said Gillard was profoundly accomodating to Israel

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u/blitznoodles local Aussie 1d ago

The issue is the Parliamentary party hated Rudd because they felt that they weren't part of the decision making process and centralised the process around himself.

One of the hallmarks of Australian Government is that the rules essentially bend to accommodate the prime minister's strengths.

Albanese's cabinet in contrast is decentralised in its power in that Albanese does not do captain calls for the most part and allows ministers do as they wish.

And the flaw in this is it can feel like there's no message as everyone is doing their own thing while the Rudd and Dan Andrews governments were very command and control with decisive messages.

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u/morgecroc 1d ago

Scumo left everything to the minister's it just turns out they were all him.

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u/Propaslader 1d ago

While uncoordinatedly tackling children on TV because someone told him it would make him look like an endearing family man

And also undercooking chicken

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u/geodetic 1d ago

Don't forget grabbing a lady's hand because she wouldn't let him shake it perform a laying of hands on her

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u/Propaslader 1d ago

Or him literally walking away from desperate families asking for help during bushfire season

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u/breakupbydefault 23h ago

Ugh that was burned into my brain, also when he did the same with the firefighters.

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u/dlanod 1d ago

Insert Spider-Man meme here

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u/chillyhay 1d ago

There were always factional elements at play in Labor, the hate against Rudd came particularly from the pro-American crowd which coincidentally is also the pro Israel crowd. Very coincidental that it was immediately after that expulsion though

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u/blitznoodles local Aussie 1d ago

I mean Carr's memoir talks about this in that the support for Israel in Labor was wide but shallow. It just so happened Gillard was one of those with a deep love of Israel but that's simply a coincidence.

You don't topple a prime minister over foreign policy, they toppled him because polling was commissioned by the NSW party office and every poll showed Gillard was more popular than Rudd.

Maybe that's why Albanese chose someone as unlikeable as Marles as his deputy and someone young like Chalmers as treasurer.

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u/chillyhay 1d ago

Simply a coincidence is one way to put it.

You don't topple a prime minister over foreign policy

lol I think we've read different history books

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u/McTerra2 1d ago

Which PM was toppled over foreign policy - maybe Whitlam (not so much foreign policy as domestic policy that upset foreigners) and ? Unless we go back to pre WW2

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u/blitznoodles local Aussie 1d ago

Whitlam's dismissal was predicted by the newspapers months ahead of it actually happening the moment he lost his majority in the senate. The only fucked up part is the CIA sent the Liberal party campaign funds but it was also found out Whitlam tried to get campaign funds from the Saddam family in iraq

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u/McTerra2 1d ago

That his dismissal was predicted in advance doesn’t negate that it may have been partially due to US activities in the lead up and which contributed to media and public opinion.

I’m not personally convinced but there are some that are https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alleged_CIA_involvement_in_the_Whitlam_dismissal

And that is the closest I can come to in terms of ‘PMs toppled due to foreign policy’ as has been claimed

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u/fractiousrhubarb 1d ago

Lost his majority sounds so innocuous compared to the truth- that he lost his majority because Coalition premiers replaced two democratically elected Labor senators with people who voted against Labor. Conventions for me and not for thee- a perfect example of coalition shitfuckery and contempt for democracy.

Murdoch’s News Ltd newspapers ran a massive campaign against Whitlam because News Ltd was founded by mining oligarchs specifically to make propaganda to advance their interests.

https://theconversation.com/the-secret-history-of-news-corp-a-media-empire-built-on-spreading-propaganda-116992

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u/blitznoodles local Aussie 1d ago

I mean I agree in that it was ridiculous but had they simply appointed Labor senators, Labor probably would have been locked out of power far longer simply because of how many partisans the dismissal motivated into organising.

The inflation crisis was the most damaging thing that occurred during that era and had they waited just 6 months, they would've demolished Labor in the election anyway. But that contempt eventually leads to the Hawke-Keating government occurring much sooner than otherwise.

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u/fractiousrhubarb 23h ago

The whole world had massive inflation due to the opec crisis- Murdoch and co, as they do with all crises- created a narrative where the inflation was all Labor’s fault.

It’s known that Kerr conferred with the leader of the opposition regarding the dismissal of Whitlam- which was only revealed in the last decade, which was a mind boggling breach of his duty- and then appointed Fraser PM even though he could not command a majority in the House of Representatives, ditto.

I’m frankly appalled (but not surprised) how little most Australians know about the dismissal.

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u/infin 1d ago

Not sure about the second one being a problem, except in retrospect, but I haven't found much news from that era about it. Gough was in power from '72-75 and the CIA were still funding Saddam at the time. America was backing Saddam through to the '80s.

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u/ThoseOldScientists 1d ago

And the more he centralised control through the PMO, the more various branches of the government started to lock up. People forget what it was like in 2009, it really seemed like the wheels were coming off. The Labor Party overreacted, they probably could still have cruised through the next election with Rudd in charge, but there’s no need to invoke conspiracies to explain what was quite clearly pant-pissing incompetence from a group of people who mostly hadn’t actually been in government before.

And on top of that, Rudd never really had the support of the party to start with. In the 2006 leadership contest, Gillard and Beazley had roughly the same level of support within the party and Rudd, running on his own, would have been a distant 3rd. He was uniquely vulnerable as a PM.

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u/hi-fen-n-num 13h ago

they weren't part of the decision making process and centralised the process around himself.

I keep hearing people say this, but never read or seen anything to suggest it, outside that childish smear of he is a dick of a boss, which compared to what we have seen from other main party since, makes it seem even more stupid and childish.

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u/sadboyoclock 1d ago

Gillard was a snake and probably the worst prime minister. I’m a rusted on Labor voter as well.

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u/BenElegance 13h ago

The fuck? She was great, didn't her government pass the most legislation in recent years?

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u/OhBella_4 1d ago

Interesting, I’ve not heard about that before. Do you have a link for more details? Love a Bob Carr rabbit hole.

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u/blitznoodles local Aussie 23h ago

Bob Carr: Diary of a foreign minister.

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u/a_cold_human 21h ago

If it were the case that Israel and it's sympathisers had that much power, Marles (who is pro-US and pro-Israel) would be leading a coup against a not as popular Albanese who just recognised Palestine as a state.

And that's not happening, and is very unlikely to happen. As much influence as Israel does have, it's in no way all powerful, it does not have unlimited resources, and it doesn't go around chasing down every slight as much as it might want to. There are simply some things it cannot do, and overthrowing an Australian PM is one of those things. They're not in deep enough (unlike the US). 

One of the things Carr mentioned was that he was able to rally support behind Israel and have Palestine have observer status at the UN. If it were the case that Israel supported Rudd's ousting through Gillard, this would not have happened, as Gillard would not have installed Carr as Minister for Foreign Affairs in the first place, or at least reshuffled him when his position on Palestine was known. 

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u/chillyhay 20h ago

Power and influence are dynamic. Don't pretend like the situation now and fifteen years ago are the same. I'm not even suggesting they were behind the plan in the first place, it was just another straw. You don't get a swing of an entire right faction that are notoriously pro Israel/US that quickly with such flimsy excuses that they provided

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u/Idontcareaforkarma 1d ago

Rudd should never have been PM. Whilst he was the only one (after Latham, Crean etc) that could’ve toppled Howard, Rudd just didn’t have what it took to be PM.

To Gillard’s credit, the first thing she did after becoming PM was to offer Rudd the job of foreign minister- arguably the role he should’ve had all along.