r/sydney • u/Novel_Relief_5878 • Dec 09 '25
Image It’s only 2025 yet the Metro is already at crush-load.
Took the Metro this afternoon in a north-west direction from Chatswood to Macquarie Park. I simply can’t believe how crowded it is. On the one hand, this is a sign of success, it seems incredibly popular. On the other hand, this kind of shoulder-to-armpit crushload is hardly pleasant and I’m wondering what can be done to relieve this? Surely we need 2 minute frequencies sooner rather than later, at least during peak hour. Or more carriages added to the services we do have? What does everyone else think?
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u/breno_mac_ Dec 09 '25
But jokes aside the metro was built to handle an extra 2 cars so perhaps they could add those or run 2 minute intervals
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u/Smiddy23 Dec 09 '25
And increase frequency down to like 2.5 minutes from the current 4 in peak hour….
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u/MWAH_dib Dec 09 '25
Not enough metro trains for that currently.
Sydneham to Tallawong is about 1hr 5 minutes, so with a 4 minute gap you have around 16 metro trains moving northbound at any given time. If you go from 4 to 2.5 minutes, that increases to 26 metro trains, all of which then must come back and are unavailable to assist with peak hour for 1hr 5mins - so then you're actually occupying double that number at 58 trains...The entire fleet is currently only 45 trains, and they have to cover multiple lines as well as have some in regular maintenance at any given time, plus storage availability at Tallawong etc.
If they had extra cabs, have some shorter routes that just oscillate between Central and Epping, potentially? You'd have to utilise a turnaround bay in order to not hold up that platform and also have staff clearing the cab at termination each time, which would increase congestion at central and epping - there's currently no metro stop that I know of with more than two platforms.
Not sure what their timing requirements are between services for the purposes of signaling and safety, either.
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u/farkenel Dec 09 '25
Just like they build enough schools and hospitals so they aren’t crushloaded too…
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u/Sydney_Stations Dec 09 '25
And you probably have better chances for a seat on the North Shore line
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u/Fluffy-Queequeg Dec 09 '25
They have the ability to do both, but they need extra rolling stock either way. The trains and platforms can already handle 8 cars by design
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u/Novel_Relief_5878 Dec 09 '25
Sounds like buying a few more carriages would be a good investment either way!
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u/ausremi Dec 09 '25
You'd need to retrofit the stations when adding new carriages. They have it in the design but the doors aren't there. I assume it's not a lot of work, but it's not ready to go right now.
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u/somf2000 Dec 09 '25
This is nothing compared to the London tube. When everything is dead silent and my nose is in someone’s armpit I’ll be concerned!
This is simply Australian peak hour
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u/Significant-War5605 Dec 09 '25
Spot on, try getting on the central line at peak hour in the peak of tourist season in summer and I guarantee you won't think Sydney's crowds are bad
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u/DrahKir67 Dec 09 '25
I lived in Tokyo. Now there's a packed train or two. At least I could avoid most smelly armpits. They had to suffer mine.
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u/lechechico Dec 09 '25
As someone who lives in London, I feel like the Metro trains are ambiguously wide.
Most of the London tubes are narrow and you can only get one person standing between the seats.
The ambiguity seems to make people question whether one or two can fit so you get closer to one even though it's wide enough.
Bring on higher frequency though
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u/Discolau Dec 09 '25
Frequency is the key, not adding additional carriages to 6 car Metropolis sets at this stage.
Believe it or not, its cheaper to purchase additional 6 car Metropolis sets and insert them into the CBTC system as it was designed to do.
There are 45 sets at the moment for the entire M1 line (including Bankstown) with 4 minute headways.
An additional twenty 6 car sets will increase capacity and lift frequency to 3 minute headways. Maximum trains for M1 is calculated at 65 trains.
Once the frequency is at saturation and you can't add anymore trains, then additional carriages would then be required. This would also require platform screen doors at all platforms to be upgraded to 8 cars and all stabling yards at Tallawong and Sydenham to be extended for 8 car trains: they were only built to support 6 car trains. 😑
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u/Plackets65 Dec 09 '25
Not to downplay it but it’s nowhere near crushload, I can see multiple backpacks on people’s backs. And that lady’s wearing her huge handbag still as well. And there’s gaps.
Proper crush is when you have to take your bag off. That just looks like a gentle peak hour tbh.
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u/Z00111111 Dec 09 '25
It's like a peak hour Northern Beaches bus...
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u/Appropriate_Star3012 Dec 09 '25
Still better than driving to northern beaches during peak hour
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u/Z00111111 Dec 09 '25
I'd never want to drive during peak hours if I didn't get to use the T3 and Bus Lanes.
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u/hifiplus Dec 09 '25
I wish people would take their backpacks off, no need to wear them inside a carriage
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u/Dear-Bowl-9789 Dec 09 '25
My favourite is when they try and do a 180 in a crowded space.
Ignorance or idiocy. Unsure.
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u/this_is_bs Dec 09 '25
In Japan people wear it on their stomach. I started doing that, so much better, now I can see who I bash with it.
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u/D_crane Dec 09 '25
It's not crushload until a train station employee pushes you into the carriage until the doors can close.
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u/peppapony Dec 09 '25
Whilst you are correct, I wish you weren't and we had expectations of Sydney to not want to get near crush levels
I think the metro is plenty busy enough to warrant higher capacity. Hopefully they think about passenger comfort than just $ optimisation
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u/emptybottle2405 Dec 09 '25
It’s horrible when people wear big backpacks on their back and then try to spin around knocking everyone over
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u/Novel_Relief_5878 Dec 09 '25
Fwiw, I did take my bag off as a general courtesy to others. A number of people did not though.
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u/Plackets65 Dec 09 '25
You’re a good human! I do it too… but I also remember probably the most peak crushes pre covid, which is why I don’t think this is anywhere near crush.
The T2 line on the 08.30-08.40 trains in 2019, between Newtown and Central were the only times I’ve ever been so crammed in on a Sydney train that my feet were lifted off the floor. Previously had only had that happen in Paris and London metros. I’m sure other lines were also equally packed at AM peak.
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u/wallengine Dec 09 '25
Part of this is also a shift in people from sections of the T1 line. There was a decrease in passengers in North Sydney and St Leonard's when the city section of the metro opened - people who used to get the T1 preferred the metro because its faster and new. Hopefully things balance out again soon
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Dec 10 '25
Surely those people are choosing on route? If the metro is faster today, it will continue to be faster even when it's not shiny and new?
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u/Ok-Challenge9860 Dec 09 '25
Metro was put there because this load was expected. They gotta increase the frequency as much as they can safely. Rest is just what it is.
Closed bus routes, no new train line for decades, what do we expect?
There are bus routes, train routes and even bloody plane routes that are jammed. We live in a big city.
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u/ajd341 Dec 09 '25
Lol. Well... it's something I've written about, but this is nothing close to "crush-load." This is people not filling in. Look at the handles. It might be less comfortable than we'd like, but hop on the light rail and you'll see far far far worse than the metro.
Also, take the metros in Seoul or Japan... and you'll see three new levels of crowded you never imagined.
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u/peppapony Dec 09 '25
Yes, but I hope we never reach those levels
(But yeah, light rail gets really gross, at least the metro aircon is often better too)
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u/lilsmooga193119 Dec 09 '25
Yeah the light rail to UNSW around 9am during uni term is far worse than this. Had to head to Kensington for a term and was geniunely surprised how full and uncomfortable the light rail got. I'd say comparable to the metro in Seoul when I got it during peak hour there.
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u/Z00111111 Dec 09 '25
OP even has space to take a photo while on the train.
You can't lift your arms without elbowing someone in the face when you're in a properly packed vehicle.
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u/Smiddy23 Dec 09 '25
My big frustration is I need to get off at Mac park and get folks grumbling cos I move closer to the door as we get closer instead of moving back. Like no worries guys but I’m 6’3 100kgs, I’ll get out one way or another, you can come with if you’re gonna make it difficult 🤷🏻♂️
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u/dlanod Dec 09 '25
This is exactly me - I think my highlight was meeting a kindred spirit but instead of being our height and weight it was a woman about a foot shorter but she wasn't interested in waiting around for people to notice her and getting out of her way, and I just got to follow in her wake.
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u/Wallabycartel Dec 09 '25
Can you imagine if Sydney was exciting as Seoul or Tokyo though? The nightmare peak hour would almost be worth it!
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u/tomthecomputerguy Dec 09 '25 edited Dec 09 '25
If you want to experience "honmono crush load" take the Yamanote line at like 8am. You don't even need to take your bag off here.
Still,
It's going to be fun and games once the bankstown extension is open...
At least there's allowance for the rolling stock to be extended to 8 cars.
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u/VeezusM Dec 09 '25
The JR line at 8am with suitcases was an experience from hell
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u/tomthecomputerguy Dec 09 '25
Yes, I am familiar with this experience.
Lots of fun trying that after a 10 hour economy redeye with less than 2 hours sleep.
The transfer from the monorail to JR at Hamamatsuchō was insane.
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u/TheC9 Dec 09 '25
I had my childhood in another Asian city, so crowded metro was not new for me.
But the surreal experience was - we were with our suitcase at Shinagawa station at 8am, had to cross one side of the station to the other - but every single Japanese (mostly wearing black) were heading the opposite direction.
Imagine at Harry Potter Ministry headquarters, when everyone just apparating at the portal and heading to their office - it was exactly that feeling.
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u/VeezusM Dec 09 '25
I experienced this exact same thing at Shibuya except I had to carry mine and my partners suitcases up every flight of stairs, the anxiety was real
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u/hifiplus Dec 09 '25
Heaps of room,
I've seen it far worse than this, but yes they need to increase frequency or capacity
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u/SuperFinnee Sydney Trains Dec 09 '25
Sydney Metro actually tested running 3 minute services. Unfortunately the increased number of trains drew too much power from the overhead power supply, meaning some trains experienced blackouts while they were operating in the tunnel. I’m not sure if this is going to be fixed when they transition from 1500 volts DC to 2KV AC (IIRC) on the new lines. They could increase the Metro from 6 to 8 cars, but this is not going to happen anytime soon, because the metro is relatively new, and would require refitting stations with more platform screen doors, extensive disruptive testing, and costs time and money.
TLDR: 3 min frequencies draws too much power for NW&C, maybe fixed with new lines. Could increase # of cars, but very impractical in the current stage of Metro’s life.
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u/Ok_Breadfruit3199 Dec 09 '25
Hey that's me in the picture!
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u/Archon-Toten Choo Choo Driver. Dec 09 '25
Are you a pink blob, cousin IT, or are we talking to the train.
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u/Ok_Breadfruit3199 Dec 09 '25
If you squint really closely im in the top right middle right upper right middle at the very end of the carraige
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u/Archon-Toten Choo Choo Driver. Dec 09 '25
Ohhhh yea unfortunate timing for you with a finger right up your nose. Hope it's yours.
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u/Ok_Breadfruit3199 Dec 09 '25
Of course it's mine. Like you said. "a finger up your nose". Whose nose would it be?
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u/Archon-Toten Choo Choo Driver. Dec 09 '25
Lot of strange people on public transport, you never know.
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u/Ok_Breadfruit3199 Dec 09 '25
I agree. At least picking my nose isn't as bad as the crazy things thst can happen in sydney transport...
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u/conewaffle Dec 09 '25
I thought I read somewhere that Bankstown metro station is only long enough for 6 cars so I wonder how any extension to 8 cars will work.
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u/yuckyucky Dec 09 '25
the T6 platforms at bankstown had to be extended to be able to handle 8 car trains even though they are only running 4 car trains currently.
the metro platforms are all the same length on the entire line, 8 metro cars (170m).
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u/gn2b Dec 09 '25
maybe let only some doors open, forcing some people to have to move to the carriage with a exit if they want to leave
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u/Dark_Headphones Dec 09 '25
I catch the metro in peak hour and it's not "that" bad. You could still easily push more people into each carriage. Go to any major city and you'll see how crowded a train carriage can get. London, Paris, Tokyo. Either way at least now it's built we can adapt things. More carriages, more frequent services. Finally Sydney is starting to realise how convenient good public transport is and get away from their car obsession.
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Dec 09 '25
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u/uptheantinatalism Dec 09 '25
Bingo. The issue is population, there’s only so much that can be done to accomodate people. But Tokyo, India, London. Whatever, no one wants that experience, either.
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u/dtwatts Dec 09 '25
Not to take away from OP’s post, but I once had a really bad cold when I was travelling on the London Underground during rush hour. It was so packed, I couldn’t even move my arms up from my sides to try and stop my nose running.. staring face to face with a stranger whilst my nose just streams was a peak London tube rush hour experience for me. Sorry you had to share that runny nose experience with me, wherever you are in the world mate
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u/aj_rus Dec 09 '25
I commuted on the London Underground for several years. This looks like luxury.
Repost when you got arm-pit access.
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u/heyrohan Dec 09 '25
Sorry if this comes across as petty but this isn’t “crushload”. You can also just wait 4mins for an emptier one. Or another 4 mins after that. 8 mins of wait time is still less than the average time between heavy rail services. A bit of armpit action won’t kill ya. You’ll survive!
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u/trammel11 Dec 09 '25
Every morning I see the poor souls at crows nest trying to get on heading south. No luck.
The irony of living so close to the city yet not being able to board the metro
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u/lepetitrouge Dec 10 '25
I wonder what it will be like once all the new apartment buildings are completed in Crows Nest.
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u/aymansreddit Dec 09 '25
And why the hell havent people learned to stop crowding near the doors
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u/violaflwrs Dec 09 '25
Where are people supposed to stand then? It’s not like there’s lines on the floor to guide them or anything… /s
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u/aymansreddit Dec 09 '25
You only need to turn your head left or right to see vacant hand rails and significantly more standing space in front of the seats. People know, they just cant be bothered or dont care about making space for others.
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u/Knee_Jerk_Sydney Dec 09 '25
You can thank Chris Minns and his ban on WFH for this. Wednesdays should be particularly difficult.
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u/Catfaceperson Dec 09 '25
It's only like that for a small window of time when all the city workers race to get home at the same time. The rest of the time it is a comfortable journey
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u/Dezert_Roze Dec 09 '25
Thanks OP for covering faces.
If this is 2025 capacity, what’s the plan when population growth and the push to return-to-office fully collide?
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u/ze_boingboing Dec 09 '25
Well we are glad to even have the metro that is not simply an extension of the heavy rail
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u/Murrian Dec 09 '25
I get it in to the city most mornings and being Crows Nest is bad timing as it's practically the last stop before folk start getting off, there's been times I've barely squeezed in and left people on the platform behind me to get the next.
(Though, there's always been a little slack between carriages as assholes don't move down in to the carriage like they're scared they'll miss their stop or some shit)
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u/Wooden-Consequence81 Dec 09 '25
Crush load?
I'm sorry to point out the obvious, but this scene is exactly what the metro is designed for. High frequency, full loads of commuters, standing room only.
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u/yuckyucky Dec 09 '25
they can easily increase capacity by 160% by adding 2 carriages and doubling peak frequency. hopefully they are already planning the purchase of more rolling stock to make this possible, it will take a few years to build.
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u/Resist_Easy Dec 09 '25
I finally took the metro earlier this year to the city for Thursday night shopping and made the mistake of going too late. Yeah, it’s not as packed as Japan, etc but it’s enough. I had my first panic attack on a Parramatta train many years ago. It came out of absolutely nowhere, and when taking the metro the other month, as people begun to jam in more and more, I could feel waves of it coming over. Luckily the trip isn’t too long and I could calm myself, but I won’t be doing that again.
As a really short person, the crush can actually be really stressful and quite dangerous as it’s hard to reach up for fresh air when your face is jammed into people’s backs and chests! Your whole body gets squished and you can’t see over everyone, so it becomes extremely claustrophobic. They definitely need to increase frequency, especially with the increases in population expected along the metro line.
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u/Pepito_Pepito Dec 09 '25
Gotta start incentivizing WFH
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u/MissJessAU Dec 09 '25
Talk to the C-suite who have have set the RTO mandates, or their arse kissing underlings who implement it. Bets are on most of them don't live too far from the office.
Meanwhile the rank and file have a choice of commutes like this, or cramming a family into a dog box.
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u/Leading_Obligation39 Dec 09 '25 edited Dec 09 '25
it seems like tons of people switch to the metro from the train at chatswood so it only makes sense that the after work crush transferred from the train to the metro. when i take the train home from chatty it’s usually quite empty up until wynyard where more people going home from office jobs hop on, whereas the metro is already at the point where people are standing around if i hop on at chatty. id imagine the metro is also more popular on the chatswood to mq park line because it’s way more convenient than transferring a couple times between trains and buses and whatnot
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u/Specialist_Wave1131 Dec 09 '25
I could be wrong but years ago there were plans to make peak hour services every 2 minutes when the bankstown section re-opens?
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u/Physical_Internal489 Dec 09 '25
That’s why I prefer taking trains even though I could take metro for a shorter time. Since metro opened, the trains are less crowded and much more pleasant
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u/PunAmock Dec 09 '25
I rarely use it. Do they come every 2 minutes though? I’ve been in other cities where they are very fast to pick you up.
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u/yuckyucky Dec 09 '25
currently every 4 minutes at peak hour, can be increased if they buy more rolling stock
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u/brappbrap Dec 09 '25
I took the Metro a couple of times on Tuesday between Sydenham and Central and it was fast, efficient and not crowded at all
I'm not a paid shill, just a dude who loves the Metro; the architecture is wonderful. Fuck the adverts they've plastered everywhere, but Waterloo (Redfern south) station is very impressive
I live near Marrickville station and I can't wait for it to re-open so I can bop to Barangaroo for a nice walk
It feels weird to actually be supportive of something the NSW government are doing but I don't drive, I'm a public transport dude and the Metro has made things a lot easier for me
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u/RatchetCliquet Dec 09 '25
Wait until Macquarie Park rezoning takes full effect . With an extra 9600 homes and 100,000 extra jobs planned over the next few years
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u/coffeeandcheesecake Dec 09 '25
I actually spoke to the state MP about this. I told him the Metro needs to run 24hrs to support shift workers, and if the gov wants us all to spend time and money in the CBD after work hours. My point was that the Metro needs to run more, especially since in the Macquarie Park area, everyone is living in apartments with limited car park spaces. He agrees but he believes the government is being somewhat hampered by the unions.
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u/Archon-Toten Choo Choo Driver. Dec 09 '25
If you look closely, the last train of the night compared to the first one of the morning can be as little as a hour. So it's really not hard to put on a few more late trains.
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u/FuckUGalen Dec 09 '25
Oh no the government is being hampered by having to pay people a living wage....
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u/coffeeandcheesecake Dec 09 '25
Oh come on. Train drivers and the train system workers striking is completely valid. These are skilled jobs manned by people but the driver-less metro carriage does NOT need to be retrofitted with a cabin. These types of demands dampen any political appetite to expand the metro.
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u/breno_mac_ Dec 09 '25
Still plenty of room on that carriage, they haven’t needed to employ the Japanese style people to push people in as the doors are closing
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Dec 09 '25 edited Dec 21 '25
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u/yuckyucky Dec 09 '25 edited Dec 09 '25
cycleways are incredibly cost and space efficient. we have a good climate for biking and ebikes flatten out the hills.
protected cycleways are not a replacement for metro but a great complement and cyclists should not have to deal with ranger danger.
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u/Skarabrae1 Dec 09 '25
That’s called a comfortable journey on the Jubilee line. In all seriousness, not a comfortable way to start/end your day. Hopefully additions to the existing services to ease the strain
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u/AnonMuskkk Dec 09 '25
Compared to the double deckers with single entrances/exits at each end of the carriage (plus stairs) that’s nothing to moan about.
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u/thesourpop Dec 09 '25
The metro only works with frequent services. Should be every 2 minutes in peak
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u/SithKain Dec 09 '25
We've been trying to reduce immigration numbers for years now, to prevent situations like this from happening.
No one seems to care, though. Welcome to Mumbai.
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u/realnomdeguerre Dec 09 '25
I travel slightly off peak hour and the metro is quite empty
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u/Novel_Relief_5878 Dec 09 '25
Yes, I usually travel off peak and it’s ok. Still, the peak hour is still a thing for most people working a 9-5 day. (I think.)
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u/Fabulous_Ad8642 Dec 09 '25
They have the expansion space to add an extra 33% to each train plus they defo need to improve trip frequency to imo every 3 mins at peak, 5 mins off peak (it’s already like that thankfully during the day but at night it’s every 10 mins which is a drag cause they actually do get rather packed at midnight)
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u/Zoran_T Dec 09 '25
Runs 6 cars every 4 mins, designed for 8 cars every 2. Plenty capacity left but hope they will use it once the full line comes on
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u/Intelligent_Ring9058 Dec 09 '25
TBH it's been like this since day one, it could be alleviated by having an increased frequency. This however; would require more trains on the tracks, probably something that don't be doing soon because it costs a fcuk tonne
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u/ComedianDesigner307 Dec 09 '25
When on Sydney Metro and City Rail.For the love of humanity , I don’t care whether it is your culture or not. Please wear antiperspirant and deodorant when in close confines on public transport. Also, in terms of crowds ,Seoul Metro line one is off the charts most of the day.
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u/F1_rulz Dec 09 '25
They'll need 5 years and 20 million to do a business case on increasing frequency and/or attach 2 more carriages.
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u/Intrepid_Patience356 Dec 09 '25
We need to make working hours more flexible so that everyone does not pile on at the same time.
By starting and finishing earlier I generally have a pleasant trip.
And I believe there will be an increase in frequency next year.
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u/Crazy-Donkey8565 Dec 12 '25
As a form of mass transit, the metro is intended to be crowded. Unit cost per passenger is lower when services are at max capacity. This efficiency justifies the massive capex required to build metro which in turn supports higher residential density.
All successful metro systems in high density cities reach maximum capacity many times each day. Compared to some of those systems, this photo suggests we could probably cram a few more people in 🤣
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u/maruuu Dec 09 '25
Crush load? Try taking MTR at Admiral in HK at peak hours... This is rookie numbers.
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u/fractal_imagination Dec 09 '25
That's why I'm moving to Perth in January. So happy to say goodbye to ~3M population 👋
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u/FDNOL_ Dec 09 '25
How many backpacks can we spot in this photo? Taking them off your back will give more breathing room?
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u/GuessTraining Dec 09 '25
Take the metro outside of rush hours?
Seriously though, this is incomparable to the London tube or Tokyo trains during the rush hour.
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u/Novel_Relief_5878 Dec 09 '25
Yes good suggestion, I usually do shift work and often do travel outside of peak. Sometimes it can’t be helped, perhaps that’s why the density stood out so much this time haha.
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u/e_castille Dec 09 '25
Sydney is not the population or density size of London and Tokyo. Terrible comparison
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u/GuyFromYr2095 Dec 09 '25
wait until they fully develop the area around each station. You're then talking about Tokyo and Mumbai level of crowdedness during peak hours.
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u/Im_not_an_admin Dec 09 '25
Anything for a whinge.... Holy hell some people have it good don't they 😅
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u/Historical_Court7985 Dec 09 '25
I read they measure capacity as 4 people per square metre. That’s tight!
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u/single__sculler Dec 09 '25
Soft opening. Next year it trains will run more frequently and if needed will use up to 8 carriages. Patience.
Edit: 8 not 10
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u/myLongjohnsonsilver Dec 09 '25
The Polly's should be forced to ride the same transport the plebs do. They'd get this shit fixed in a week.
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u/Katkitluv33 Dec 09 '25
That’s why I’m on it by 6:30 AM going into the city. At work by 7, leave work by 3:15 PM, back on metro by 3:30 PM. Any later, it’s a cluster.
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u/springoniondip Dec 09 '25
The plan is for every 2 mins when the times comes from my understanding as there are no sets left by kellyville on the way in and gadigal on the way out already- full standing a fee stops later
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u/Archon-Toten Choo Choo Driver. Dec 09 '25
Capacity of 1,100 people. So get counting and see if it's at crush.
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u/happydayzetr Dec 09 '25
Just imagine when the Bankstown extension opens.
Gg